Author Topic: New DD  (Read 1958 times)

Offline Graeme H Burvill

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Re: New DD
« Reply #15 on: January 13, 2010, 10:09:19 am »
Yea you can do quite a lot with these little engines. The main thing tho is like john said, reliability and maintainability are key. i could throw a bigger turbo and all that on it, but the talon gets a turbo first. I'd like to work on taking the stock setup on this car to a decent level, with a good tune. I may also spend money on just making this car more comfortable to drive. I think the first thing i will do is get a nice big set of fog lights. I've been going to rallies in my buddies swift. It can go everywhere but it definately needs some bigger lighting. Good for gettin out on them forest stages.

As for quarter mile times....heh definately not the most impressive car in that area. Decent little auto cross unit tho. Quick and light weight.

Talon TSI-Champagne...She must live again...

Offline John Hartman

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Re: New DD
« Reply #16 on: January 13, 2010, 11:27:29 am »
hehehe. :)  Dissapointing that would be.

I remember back to a few years ago.  My Talon was a 13.0-13.3 kinda car.  Pretty quick for a pump gas street car.  I ran against a turbo Sprint on the street, from a roll.  I had to push it to slowly walk away from him.  I suspect his car was a high 13 second car.  Not bad for a single cam 3 cylinder.
91 Eagle Talon TSi 5spd awd.  GT-12, TriFlow Cams, 850s, Tial, JIC, Jackal, sticky rubber.
86 Merkur XR4Ti 5spd, rwd, turbo, 91,381km.  Original paint, heated leather. intercooled, big VAM, Full 3" exhaust, Cossie sway bar, 16" tires.
06 Mazdaspeed6 6spd awd, DISI turbo, heated leather HIDs, Corksport, Cobb, Konig, Centric...
2018 VW Golf Alltrack turbo Tornado Red, 6mt, some free mods

jasonphan

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Re: New DD
« Reply #17 on: January 13, 2010, 06:13:36 pm »
Wow ,i use to own an 89 turbo sprint. These little car are a blast to drive,but i go through tires alot. Well have fun with your new dd. :), i sure did. :)

Offline Graeme H Burvill

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Re: New DD
« Reply #18 on: January 13, 2010, 10:38:20 pm »
I am not sure about how hard you have to push a turbo 3 to get in to the 13's. Pretty mod'd i would suspect. I know like the fastest naturally asperated swift gti (4 cyl non turbo), is in the 13's. And that is like massive amounts of modification, internals and all. Not sure about a t3, definatley a bigger fuel and intake setup, probably had the thing just fully pimped with a stand alone. But who knows, maybe just a tuning genious with some slight upgrades.
Talon TSI-Champagne...She must live again...

Offline Jason Harwood

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Re: New DD
« Reply #19 on: January 14, 2010, 07:15:32 am »
I am not sure about how hard you have to push a turbo 3 to get in to the 13's. Pretty mod'd i would suspect. I know like the fastest naturally asperated swift gti (4 cyl non turbo), is in the 13's. And that is like massive amounts of modification, internals and all. Not sure about a t3, definatley a bigger fuel and intake setup, probably had the thing just fully pimped with a stand alone. But who knows, maybe just a tuning genious with some slight upgrades.

Those swift 1.3 GT's have a crazy valve train for them.
1 simple ECU upgrade and the things will rev to 9,000RPM.
88' MX6 Turbo - 14.2 @ 97.51MPH
94' MX6 V6 - 13.9 @ 96.7MPH
93' Civic Turbo - 14.7 @ 90MPH (bad tune)
90' Civic SI - Auto-X Machine
97' Eclipse GSX 13.6 @ 105MPH
96' Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo
97' Acura EL 14.5 @ 98MPH
'02 Lexus IS300 15.125 @ 91MPH
97' CR-V Winter Beater.
04' WRB WRX STI

Offline Graeme H Burvill

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Re: New DD
« Reply #20 on: January 14, 2010, 12:02:17 pm »
Yea they are decent little engines. My room mate has a gti, pretty fun lil car. You can rev the piss out of it. Makes decent power at high rpm's too. Heard of some guys who turbo charged the gti engine, pretty nutty.
Talon TSI-Champagne...She must live again...

Offline John Hartman

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Re: New DD
« Reply #21 on: January 14, 2010, 05:31:39 pm »
But Graeme, again, turbo and N/T  :)

Whats the fastest N/T Talon?  not sure, but I would guess, all motor around 14's?  Whats the fastest turbo one?  Yea, you get the idea  :D
91 Eagle Talon TSi 5spd awd.  GT-12, TriFlow Cams, 850s, Tial, JIC, Jackal, sticky rubber.
86 Merkur XR4Ti 5spd, rwd, turbo, 91,381km.  Original paint, heated leather. intercooled, big VAM, Full 3" exhaust, Cossie sway bar, 16" tires.
06 Mazdaspeed6 6spd awd, DISI turbo, heated leather HIDs, Corksport, Cobb, Konig, Centric...
2018 VW Golf Alltrack turbo Tornado Red, 6mt, some free mods

Offline Graeme H Burvill

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Re: New DD
« Reply #22 on: January 15, 2010, 03:33:04 pm »
yea but i figure the lack of a cylinder and a cam makes up the difference... :P

its simple math really... ;D
Talon TSI-Champagne...She must live again...

Offline John Hartman

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Re: New DD
« Reply #23 on: January 16, 2010, 04:41:00 pm »
no its not.  Turbos increase VE by huge margins.  a bit more displacement and a second set of valves does, but not to that degree.

Look at the BMW V12 in the McLaren F1.  Supercar, a million Pounds Sterling, totally hawt car!!  Its a 6.1 liter engine and tuned to the ultimate degree by BMW for McLaren.  627 hp and 480lbs/feet(Claimed crank hp, not wheel hp)

Now do the math on that with hp per liter.

now look at Lowells Laser engine.  nearly 500 to ALL 4 WHEELS.  That is the 627 CRANK hp of the BMW mill.  And that is tuned by a  very good professional tuner, yes, but NOT a BMW factory motorsport team of engineers and with all that comes with it.

Then do the math again, for hp and torque per liter.  Why the HUGE difference?  Hint:  its shiny and snail shaped  :)

It happens ALL the time.

Another simple example.  BMW 328i cars in the E36 variety, mid-late 90s.  Making a claimed 200ish hp over the variations.  Dyno at about 175 or so.  Put on header, chip, intake, full exhaust.  Maybe break 200 wheel hp. 

Add a turbo.  Run ONLY 5-6 PSI.  Yes, thats it.  Torque jumps over 100lbs/feet and hp jumps 60-80 wheel hp!  There is a great BMW tuner in Abbotsford that has a dyno and fabs thier own stuff, does thier own ECU tuning etc and its VERY common to see these numbers.  I did a bunch of research on this subject as I amost bought one.

With the Suzuki example, yes the 1.3l twincam is a great engine and has more potential airflow vs the 1liter single cam 2v head engine NORMALLY ASPIRATED.  And yes, with a few tweaks to the twincam, you will get more power, but the torque hardly will change.

Whereas with the forced induction wee 1.0 2v engine, you do exhaust, intake, bigger turbo(hell anything is bigger than the factory one), up the boost and fuel(if needed) and move the intercooler up front, and your torque would double.  Maybe more.  And the power would surpass the twincam car.

its like a Honda Vtec motor.  Tons of power per liter, very well built etc.  But look at the torque curve and torque numbers as well as area under the curve.

Look at a stock S2000(the early 2 liter car).  Then look at JUST A BONE STOCK DSM engine.  A bit down on power(simple and cheap to fix)  15 years older, lower tech.  But way better area under the curve.  Or look at an early WRX.  Same displacement, similar power, but loads more torque.  And huge area under the curve.

or a Mini Cooper and Cooper S(either supercharged or turbo)  Not even comparable.  One is a total slug, economy car feeling, gutless as hell.  The other, far from it.
91 Eagle Talon TSi 5spd awd.  GT-12, TriFlow Cams, 850s, Tial, JIC, Jackal, sticky rubber.
86 Merkur XR4Ti 5spd, rwd, turbo, 91,381km.  Original paint, heated leather. intercooled, big VAM, Full 3" exhaust, Cossie sway bar, 16" tires.
06 Mazdaspeed6 6spd awd, DISI turbo, heated leather HIDs, Corksport, Cobb, Konig, Centric...
2018 VW Golf Alltrack turbo Tornado Red, 6mt, some free mods

Offline Remi Raymond

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Re: New DD
« Reply #24 on: January 16, 2010, 09:07:34 pm »
What John is trying to say is turbos are silly and real cars have pushrods and 7.3L
They're like expensive pokemon... gotta catch 'em all.

Offline John Hartman

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Re: New DD
« Reply #25 on: January 16, 2010, 09:16:29 pm »
and 2 valves per cylinder

and iron heads

and drum brakes at both ends

and live axles at both ends

and leaf springs.

and carbs.  Wait I kinda like carbs...
91 Eagle Talon TSi 5spd awd.  GT-12, TriFlow Cams, 850s, Tial, JIC, Jackal, sticky rubber.
86 Merkur XR4Ti 5spd, rwd, turbo, 91,381km.  Original paint, heated leather. intercooled, big VAM, Full 3" exhaust, Cossie sway bar, 16" tires.
06 Mazdaspeed6 6spd awd, DISI turbo, heated leather HIDs, Corksport, Cobb, Konig, Centric...
2018 VW Golf Alltrack turbo Tornado Red, 6mt, some free mods

Offline J. Todd Murie

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Re: New DD
« Reply #26 on: January 19, 2010, 05:50:14 pm »
Live axles are pretty fun too.

Offline Don Woltjer

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Re: New DD
« Reply #27 on: January 24, 2010, 12:35:49 pm »
I had one of those cars, abosolutley loved it. my was slightly done and would rip hondas in two, lol
1990 Eagle Talon AWD Tsi

Offline Graeme H Burvill

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Re: New DD
« Reply #28 on: March 11, 2010, 09:18:21 pm »
My cat almost died, cost me 700 bucks. So I had to get my deposit back and let the sale pass me by. So no more turbo 3cyl for me...:(
Talon TSI-Champagne...She must live again...

Offline John Hartman

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Re: New DD
« Reply #29 on: March 11, 2010, 09:51:22 pm »
good choice Graeme.  Straight up.
91 Eagle Talon TSi 5spd awd.  GT-12, TriFlow Cams, 850s, Tial, JIC, Jackal, sticky rubber.
86 Merkur XR4Ti 5spd, rwd, turbo, 91,381km.  Original paint, heated leather. intercooled, big VAM, Full 3" exhaust, Cossie sway bar, 16" tires.
06 Mazdaspeed6 6spd awd, DISI turbo, heated leather HIDs, Corksport, Cobb, Konig, Centric...
2018 VW Golf Alltrack turbo Tornado Red, 6mt, some free mods