crank end play specs, and weird noise help

[GlenMartin]

so i have a bunch of things out the car, replacing the oil pan and i figured well i might as well check the crank shaft end play. however i don't have my service manual with me, and i keep getting conflicting results on the internet while searching. some sites say the tolerance is between .002" - .007" with a maximum of 0.0098" others just say between .002"-.012"

the reading i got is .009" maybe a tad bit under. is the motor hooped or is that reading still ok, on its way out? what are you thoughts? the only reason why i am inspecting this, is because i am trouble shooting a noise. it sounds like a rotational noise, but it is almost a knock as well. when you depress the clutch, it totally goes away. the noise is only there at idle, and only randomly. if you accelerate the noise quickly goes away. its coming from the tranny side of the motor.

i suspected that if my crank shaft end play was bad enough it could be the crank pushing the flywheel/clutch into contact with the pressure plate. if that makes sense, and making noise. now i am not so sure. .009" is not much movement.

no other sign or symptoms as to what might be causing this. please feel free to discuss, and throw around theories.

also if my thrust bearings are on the way out, in an effort to extend the motors life can i just simply replace them? i have seen articles online of people doing it, and having good results, but no articles on how to do it. whether in the car or not.

[GlenMartin]

i think i may have answered one of my questions. i came across this thread on tuners, and is really good at describing noises, and their causes. it would appear that my throw out bearing is going/gone.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-miscellaneous/337788-what-causing-irritating-noise.html

[Brett Haviland]

Spec is .002-.007 with a max tolerance of .009. The car will run fine untill around. 014-.016 where it will take out the crank sensor at that point, and the clutch pedal will sink around hard right corners (2g only)

My eclipse had. 009 on it so I changed all bottom end bearings (rods and mains/thrust) (engine in car BTW, just dropped the pan). I did not see anything besides normal bearing wear from hard use. Changed em out and now my end play sits at around. 005. I'm going to check it every 5000 km's and see if it stays.

Oh and that rotational noise that goes away when u push in your clutch is the transmission bearings are wearing out causing slack inside the trans. If the flluid is full of metal particals (like silverisb oil), then the trans is in dire need of repair. If the oil still looks cleanish, then u cxan probably drive it fine untill the noise gets too loud, or the trans won't shift properly anymore

[GlenMartin]

Spec is .002-.007 with a max tolerance of .009. The car will run fine untill around. 014-.016 where it will take out the crank sensor at that point, and the clutch pedal will sink around hard right corners (2g only)

My eclipse had. 009 on it so I changed all bottom end bearings (rods and mains/thrust) (engine in car BTW, just dropped the pan). I did not see anything besides normal bearing wear from hard use. Changed em out and now my end play sits at around. 005. I'm going to check it every 5000 km's and see if it stays.

Oh and that rotational noise that goes away when u push in your clutch is the transmission bearings are wearing out causing slack inside the trans. If the flluid is full of metal particals (like silverisb oil), then the trans is in dire need of repair. If the oil still looks cleanish, then u cxan probably drive it fine untill the noise gets too loud, or the trans won't shift properly anymore

i will drain the tranny fluid and inspect it. you sure about the tranny bearings wearing out? like the inut shaft bearing? cause i have had some of those guy on my honda tranny's and it sounds way way different. there is no noise what so ever when i am driving. in my honda motors it would just get louder when driving. i realize the tranny's are way different, but i thought i should mention it.

taken from tuners.

"While the car is idling in neutral with the clutch out, you hear a rattling or light grinding sound from the engine bay. If pushing the clutch in makes the noise stop, it's your throw out bearing, or TOB. If there are no problems with shifting or going into gear, it's probably ok. (These are just noisy sometimes). But you definitely want to keep an eye on it, and be ready to replace it with a new OEM one when you have the tranny out or if other clutch-related problems pop up."

that is an exact description of what is happening. second question if i do replace it, i will be installing a new clutch, and flywheel. should i use the one included with the clutch or should i opt for the oem one? i have heard on other forums that after market clutches are usually designed to be run with their throw out bearings. other brand forums though. i have seen and heard on various dsm forums to use an oem one. the car shifts fine, except for when accelerating hard, and going from first to second. however there is a horrible aftermarket shifter in there. plus the bushings are all worn out on the linkages, and there is quite a bit of play in the shifter itself. i kind of chaulked it up to that.

how much were the all the lower bearings brett? and what brands did you use? how did you align everything? how long did it take you?

[Rob Armstrong]

Oem tob.

[GlenMartin]

Oem tob.

ok rob thanx. would beck arnley suffice, or a true mitsu oem?

[Jordan Kruger]

Only ever go with an OEM release bearing.   RTM racing.

[GlenMartin]

Ya figured as much. The previous owner had a clutch installed just before I bought it, I bet it wasn't an oem throw out bearing. Lasted less than 20,000km. Unless Brett is correct, which I hope he is not. But that statement scares me, cause he rarely is. Wrong that is. Guess I might as well pull the tranny while i have the t-case and everything out. Doesn't look like too tough a job from her on out.

[Brett Haviland]

It is true that it "MAY" be the TOB, but I have chased that noise several times on many different cars including dsm's and more often then not it's been a loose trans. And yes, dsm trans are a lot diff then a honda trans. I know the noise ur talking about in the honda trans, it's nothing like the dsm rattly tranny.

Also it should be noted that I have ordered a OEM bearing (TOB) from RTM, and it was identical to the bearing I recieved with the ACT clutch kit I had purchased.   They were both Japan made bearings. I have also seen the OEM bearings come in beck arnley boxes as well as napa altrom product line.

As far as the bottom end bearings, I used altrom bearings, which were made in Japan bearings. They were like 150-200 for the main and rod bearing set if I remember. The brand (TAIHO) is used my many import OEM's . Could have been cheaper....cant exactly remember.

It took me around 4-5 hours from beginning to end.